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Post by DAS (formerly BushAdmirer) on Sept 30, 2011 17:59:59 GMT
@ Toby - Pedophiles who molest little boys are homosexuals. But it doesn't follow that male homosexuals are pedophiles. We have plenty of outrageous and criminal behavior in the heterosexual community too. So it isn't fair to lump those who don't offend in with the offenders.
On the other hand, it is correct for adoption agencies to worry that a gay male couple seeking to adopt a young boy might be pedophiles. They should have a careful background check and follow up if they're allowed to adopt.
Lesbians, like the one in the article you cited, are equally offensive. But their behavior doesn't indicate that other lesbians would behave in that manner.
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Post by toby on Sept 30, 2011 21:59:04 GMT
BA posted.:-Lesbians, like the one in the article you cited, are equally offensive. But their behavior doesn't indicate that other lesbians would behave in that manner.
Toby comments.:- It did strike me as very suspicious that an eight year old boy who is the adopted child of a lesbian couple should wish to become a girl, if it happens in one pseudo-family then it can happen in others !
Old saying.:- Where there is smoke there is fire !
I still reckon the perfect Family is a Man and a Woman in Wedlock, with their own children.
All else is just a pale imitation !!
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Post by ♫anna♫ on Oct 1, 2011 4:55:48 GMT
There's no reason for homosexuals to be paranoid or offended if someone doesn't care for their life style! Anna, with all due respect, I think you are missing the whole point of the homosexual lifestyle argument. At the end of the day, homosexuals could care less what you, or I think about them. We are only one person. However, it's when a collective group of people (society) agree that the homosexual lifestyle is wrong, and that they shouldn't have a family -- that's the problem. That's their causation for being paranoid or offended when someone says they can't be who they are, or it's wrong. If more people agree homosexuality is wrong, the less likely homosexuals will be able to have a life that heterosexuals have (reminding you that when you remove the sexuality aspect of a male or female, they are still human beings). What we have allowed society to do is focus on something that is different with a person, and because of that difference, treat them like lesser human beings (or not like humans at all) because they are different. It is exactly what society has done in the past with race and religion. So there is no way you could intellectually deny that homosexuality does not tie in with race and religion because we have prosecuted those of different races and of different religions in the past (and to a lesser extent still do to this day, unfortunately) as we are doing with homosexuals in most parts of the world where they are denied rights, or the freedom to be who they are. Hate begets hate. [/color][/size][/quote] No one should be superior or inferior to someone based on race, class, gender, religion, or sexual orientation. That is my personal belief. However, we live in a society where everyone is trying to be superior then the other, and this labelling is why we are so divided, and why we will never achieve peace. [/quote] Dearest Lauren, The topic of this thread is really more about free speech. There is no talk on this thread promoting hatred towards homosexuals. The mistreatment of homosexuals in other countries, etc. is an outrage, but that's the topic for another thread.
A forced pc fassade and prohibition of discussion is not healthy and not in the best interest of all parties corncerned including homosexuals.
Some people, including some homosexuals, prefer to live in their own communities too. That has nothing to do with hatred, but more a love or attraction for one's own community, way of life, etc..
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Post by toby on Oct 1, 2011 8:12:21 GMT
Lauren posted.:-No one should be superior or inferior to someone based on race, class, gender, religion, or sexual orientation. That is my personal belief. However, we live in a society where everyone is trying to be superior then the other, and this labelling is why we are so divided, and why we will never achieve peace.
Toby comments.:- I remember the days when Homosexuals went quietly about their business, kept their sexuality to themselves and lived in harmony in society.
It's only been a few decades since the urge for outing and confrontation began and I suppose those initial brave souls who announced to the shocked world, 'looky here we are Homosexual and proud of it', !! never considered that other Homosexuals would have a problem with all the sudden attention focussed upon them and that they too would have to conform to the new Homosexual way of life.
If you were to ask any elderly Homosexual which is the better time frame to be Homosexual, the days before Outing became common, or the days after Outing was common, then most would choose the days before Outing.
The so-called,'labelling', you mentioned was initiated by the Homosexuals themselves and like opening of Pandoras box, cannot be reversed.
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Post by ♫anna♫ on Oct 2, 2011 7:19:54 GMT
[ Again I avoid terms like "morally wrong". Expressing preferences or just being frightened or turned off by first hand experiences in the homosexual scene should be OK.
There's no reason for homosexuals to be paranoid or offended if someone doesn't care for their life style! If someone claims homosexuality is superior-fine! I'll even defend that person's 1st admendment right to say that!You seem to be fixated by this "homosexual lifestyle" idea so perhaps you could explain what it is? BushAdmirer has pointed out some antics that I certainly wouldn't want to see. But he knows that most same sex couples don't behave like that. We already know that same sex couples can bring up children, form lasting and satisfactory relationships, go to work, play sport, have hobbies, attend church..... So what is it about their "lifestyle" to disapprove of? Dearest SkyLark! Sorry about the delay in answering! Pretty busy offline!
Reservations and critical observations are more fitting expressions than the word "disapproval that you use. I put up a number of posts on related threads which answered your question and it's probably more appropriate to take this discussion there ( I could send you the links ) rather than repeat everything here.
This thread is more about free speech. Does the young boy, Dakota have the right to express an opinion. Did the German teacher act appropriately when he turned a German language class into a forum about homosexuality?, etc.
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Post by Lauren on Oct 3, 2011 0:12:46 GMT
This thread is more about free speech. Does the young boy, Dakota have the right to express an opinion. Does Dakota have a right to his own opinion? Yes. Does he have the right to express it in a high school class, well that is up for debate, depending on what we view as who is in control. The teacher has more control over Dakota. The school district has more control over the teacher. This whole situation cancels each other out. [/color][/size][/quote] It is weird to have language classes diverge from things other then the language. I do not think he should have brought religion or homosexuality in the class, as it has nothing to do with the german language and nouns and verbs, ect...ect... HOWEVER, despite that, it is clear that the teacher made a policy about zero tolerance in his class. I've had zero tolerance classes. You learn the rules quickly, if you don't follow them, adios. Everyone knows this, and since Dakota is an honour student, I think he knew that too. What Dakota should have done was kept his mouth shut, waited until class was over, and then went to the principals office. Then he could have formally addressed the issue and the teacher's teaching. There would have been an inquiry. The school would have seen the pictures of the two males kissing (some might find it offensive; others not) and the teacher would have been asked to take the pictures down, and reprimanded (assuming that the pictures bothered everyone in the class, and not just one person).
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Post by ♫anna♫ on Oct 3, 2011 5:08:33 GMT
This thread is more about free speech. Does the young boy, Dakota have the right to express an opinion. Does Dakota have a right to his own opinion? Yes. Does he have the right to express it in a high school class, well that is up for debate, depending on what we view as who is in control. The teacher has more control over Dakota. The school district has more control over the teacher. This whole situation cancels each other out. [/color][/size][/quote] It is weird to have language classes diverge from things other then the language. I do not think he should have brought religion or homosexuality in the class, as it has nothing to do with the german language and nouns and verbs, ect...ect... HOWEVER, despite that, it is clear that the teacher made a policy about zero tolerance in his class. I've had zero tolerance classes. You learn the rules quickly, if you don't follow them, adios. Everyone knows this, and since Dakota is an honour student, I think he knew that too. What Dakota should have done was kept his mouth shut, waited until class was over, and then went to the principals office. Then he could have formally addressed the issue and the teacher's teaching. There would have been an inquiry. The school would have seen the pictures of the two males kissing (some might find it offensive; others not) and the teacher would have been asked to take the pictures down, and reprimanded (assuming that the pictures bothered everyone in the class, and not just one person). [/quote] It seems like Dakota just made this remark to a friend and was overheard and denounced.
The "zero tolerance" you describe is bigoted towards religion and religious beliefs.
Dakota was not advocating hatred or violence towards homosexuals in any form.
I agree with you that it isn't appropriate for a teacher to use a classroom to promote some minority lifestyle.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2011 16:32:29 GMT
I think all that depends on circumstances we don't know....was the teacher turning the class into a forum about homosexuality? In any event the head seems to have recognised that the boy was wrongly suspended and the parents should have left the matter at that, instead of manipulating this into a "persecuted Christians" circus.
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Post by Lauren on Oct 3, 2011 17:09:35 GMT
It seems like Dakota just made this remark to a friend and was overheard and denounced. One, or more, of the students in the German class could be homosexual. If the teacher heard him, he must have said it loud enough so others could hear him too. I guess you have never been in a school that has evoked a zero tolerance policy, otherwise you would know that the zero tolerance policy is not prejudiced and protects in the classroom who are of: - different religions
- different races/ethnic backgrounds
- sexual orientation
- general bullying
- different genders
What if Dakota had said, 'I think all African Americans are wrong?' or that, 'I think women are stupid and have no right to be in school' or 'I think every religion, but my own is wrong' Would you have still think Dakota should not have been reprimanded? Is the teacher still out of line for calling him out? Because I think that would be advocating hatred if Dakota had said those things to those of different races, genders, and religious affiliation. And if you do believe that the teacher would be right in calling the student out, what's the difference between the above situations and homosexuality?
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Post by Lauren on Oct 3, 2011 17:14:27 GMT
I remember the days when Homosexuals went quietly about their business, kept their sexuality to themselves and lived in harmony in society. LOL. You know, honestly, I've never seen a gay or lesbian person walk around with a sign that says 'hey, I'm gay' so, I have no idea what you are talking about when you say keeping to themselves. What new homosexual way of life? If anything, it has some-what improved i.e. not getting arrested for being gay. There are still some kinks to work out, but as with anything, that takes time. I know elderly homosexuals, and to be honest, for most of them, it is nice to not have to sneak around to see the person they love.
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Post by Lauren on Oct 3, 2011 17:22:58 GMT
It did strike me as very suspicious that an eight year old boy who is the adopted child of a lesbian couple should wish to become a girl, if it happens in one pseudo-family then it can happen in others ! Toby, you do realize that it's heterosexual couples who produce homosexual children, right? I mean, if we are pointing the finger at this lesbian couple who actually may have adopted a child who is transgendered, we should also be pointing the finger at heterosexual couples who keep having these children. And FYI, as a person who has worked with the LGBT community, children know from a very early age that they are different, whether it be if they are gay or transgendered. However most of them don't say anything because they are afraid of what their 'normal' parents might think, or not accept them. Maybe this girl was comfortable telling her adoptive lesbian parents that she was born into the wrong body without being judged. Maybe she knew they would be more accepting. That eerily reminds me of what Hitler said about races, and how the perfect race was Aryan. People who weren't aryan were just a pale imitation (and I am, of course, paraphrasing).
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Post by ♫anna♫ on Oct 3, 2011 17:51:28 GMT
It did strike me as very suspicious that an eight year old boy who is the adopted child of a lesbian couple should wish to become a girl, if it happens in one pseudo-family then it can happen in others ! Toby, you do realize that it's heterosexual couples who produce homosexual children, right? I mean, if we are pointing the finger at this lesbian couple who actually may have adopted a child who is transgendered, we should also be pointing the finger at heterosexual couples who keep having these children. And FYI, as a person who has worked with the LGBT community, children know from a very early age that they are different, whether it be if they are gay or transgendered. However most of them don't say anything because they are afraid of what their 'normal' parents might think, or not accept them. Maybe this girl was comfortable telling her adoptive lesbian parents that she was born into the wrong body without being judged. Maybe she knew they would be more accepting. Anna's reply is here:biglinmarshall.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=science&thread=1082&page=1
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