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Post by mouse on Aug 20, 2010 7:35:34 GMT
which is widely used by the portugese...and as they were great ones for exploring...they naturally used their language... where the thinking came from it was a made up word by whites...shows a great deal of ignorence.....
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Post by jean on Aug 20, 2010 8:58:51 GMT
Since the n-word is causing so much outcry maybe we should take a look at the orgins of this word. The article that i quoted below also presents the opinion that mean spirited honkey tonks coined the n-word to humilate Blacks, but i think the Latin orgin is more believable and likely... The origin of all words for 'black' in Romance languages - Spanish negro, Italian nero, even French noir - is the Latin word niger.But the ultimate origin of the word doesn't tell you a great deal about its connotations as it's developed through usage. Moreover, what Robin Lakoff is saying in your link is that 'black person' doesn't come directly from Latin, but from a deliberate, intentionally pejorative mispronunciation of the Spanish negroIt just happens to have ended up with the same vowel as the original Latin, but those who first used it as a jibe were almost certainly unaware of that.
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Post by randomvioce on Aug 20, 2010 10:01:50 GMT
Since the n-word is causing so much outcry maybe we should take a look at the orgins of this word. Why? What difference does it make? The origin of the word is not relevant, but it is the offence that it now causes is. Let me try to explain it to you another way. The term 'Yidish' has an equally valid origin, which I need not go in great detail; suffice to say the term can be used in legitimate usage. However, the term ‘Yid’ is used as a term of abuse. In this Country there is a football team whose fans call themselves ‘Yid Army’ because many of their supporters are Jewish, but you try going on TV in this Country and using the term ‘Yid’ and see how far you get. What would you say if a football pundit said ‘I see the Yids are trying to sign William Gallas’?
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Post by jean on Aug 20, 2010 10:26:17 GMT
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Post by fretslider on Aug 20, 2010 11:49:56 GMT
Since the n-word is causing so much outcry maybe we should take a look at the orgins of this word. Why? What difference does it make? The origin of the word is not relevant, but it is the offence that it now causes is. Let me try to explain it to you another way. The term 'Yidish' has an equally valid origin, which I need not go in great detail; suffice to say the term can be used in legitimate usage. However, the term ‘Yid’ is used as a term of abuse. In this Country there is a football team whose fans call themselves ‘Yid Army’ because many of their supporters are Jewish, but you try going on TV in this Country and using the term ‘Yid’ and see how far you get. What would you say if a football pundit said ‘I see the Yids are trying to sign William Gallas’? I'd say Tottenham haven't a hope.
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Post by fretslider on Aug 20, 2010 11:56:49 GMT
Since the n-word is causing so much outcry maybe we should take a look at the orgins of this word. Why? What difference does it make? The origin of the word is not relevant, but it is the offence that it now causes is. Let me try to explain it to you another way. The term 'Yidish' has an equally valid origin, which I need not go in great detail; suffice to say the term can be used in legitimate usage. However, the term ‘Yid’ is used as a term of abuse. In this Country there is a football team whose fans call themselves ‘Yid Army’ because many of their supporters are Jewish, but you try going on TV in this Country and using the term ‘Yid’ and see how far you get. What would you say if a football pundit said ‘I see the Yids are trying to sign William Gallas’? Incidentally, my grandfather was a yid. So what? Its weak minded people who demand a right to be offended. Such a bunch of delicate flowers. On the N word, black men call each other a n i g g e r all the time. So how are you going to stop that, then?
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Post by randomvioce on Aug 20, 2010 11:59:04 GMT
I'd say Tottenham haven't a hope. Yes, but you wouldn't say the yiddos haven't a hope, at least you wouldn't say that on telly and get away with it.
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Post by fretslider on Aug 20, 2010 12:01:14 GMT
I'd say Tottenham haven't a hope. Yes, but you wouldn't say the yiddos haven't a hope, at least you wouldn't say that on telly and get away with it. Why,? Surely even you know the yids haven't a hope. Who says I wouldn't?
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Post by randomvioce on Aug 20, 2010 12:09:04 GMT
On the N word, black men call each other a n i g g e r all the time. So how are you going to stop that, then? Stop it? It is not about stopping it as such. Context is everything here fretty. Black people using the term is fine as it is in the correct context, white people using the term, in the right context is fine. same as the term Yid, I don't have a problem with the term 'Yid' being used in the correct context. It is when the term is used in a context that some people will find offensive that should be at least, socially unacceptable.
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Post by randomvioce on Aug 20, 2010 12:10:18 GMT
Not if you wanted to work on TV, you wouldn't.
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Post by mouse on Aug 20, 2010 12:56:00 GMT
but a honkey being a person is only acording to SOME just as only SOME black people refer to nig-ers..i mix with quite a few black people not once have i heard any of them use the term perhaps its as was decribed to me as some thing only the ""low class"" do or those wishing to go"" backwards and play victim"" a little like those who complain people are ""too white""when those people have gone beyond ""the hood and all its invented constraints""and live different lives
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Post by jean on Aug 20, 2010 13:24:37 GMT
The point, mouse, is that a honky tonk is not a person at all.
Though it can be used as an adjective with a noun, it isn't a noun itself. And as an adjective, it doesn't mean 'white', either pejoratively or otherwise.
Just let's be accurate here.
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Post by mouse on Aug 20, 2010 13:32:20 GMT
i didnt write or make any refference to honkey TONK...only honkey
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Post by jean on Aug 20, 2010 13:43:13 GMT
I know you didn't, mouse.
But Anna did - #18 & 39.
That's why my post was addressed to her, not you - it even said 'Anna'.
(I like accuracy, even when we're talking about insults.)
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Post by riotgrrl on Aug 20, 2010 14:07:09 GMT
I know you didn't, mouse. But Anna did - #18 & 39. That's why my post was addressed to her, not you - it even said 'Anna'. (I like accuracy, even when we're talking about insults.) Jean, you DID say 'Mouse' and address your post to her. What a riddie for you!!! ;D
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Post by riotgrrl on Aug 20, 2010 14:08:51 GMT
(N.B. Riddie = beamer.)
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Post by mouse on Aug 20, 2010 14:25:08 GMT
The point, mouse, is that a honky tonk is not a person at all. Though it can be used as an adjective with a noun, it isn't a noun itself. And as an adjective, it doesn't mean 'white', either pejoratively or otherwise. Just let's be accurate here. looks like its adressed to me..but its of no real concern ....as i have never thought a honkey tonk was a person in the first place.... nor did i think the word mean white....it may be used in that context...however just because a word is used/abused ...but no worries
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Post by jean on Aug 20, 2010 16:30:59 GMT
Mouse (and riot): looks like its adressed to me... My #42 was addressed to Anna. You replied to it in your #50 - you even quoted my 'Anna' in your reply. You missed the point of what I was saying to Anna. So then I addressed my #51 to you, and had to explain further in my #53, also to you. In #53, I said 'my post was addressed to Anna.' The 'was' indicated that I was talking about a previous post, not the current one. Clear now?
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Post by fretslider on Aug 20, 2010 17:51:39 GMT
Why? What difference does it make? The origin of the word is not relevant, but it is the offence that it now causes is. Let me try to explain it to you another way. The term 'Yidish' has an equally valid origin, which I need not go in great detail; suffice to say the term can be used in legitimate usage. However, the term ‘Yid’ is used as a term of abuse. In this Country there is a football team whose fans call themselves ‘Yid Army’ because many of their supporters are Jewish, but you try going on TV in this Country and using the term ‘Yid’ and see how far you get. What would you say if a football pundit said ‘I see the Yids are trying to sign William Gallas’? Incidentally, my grandfather was a yid. So what? Its weak minded people who demand a right to be offended. Such a bunch of delicate flowers. On the N word, black men call each other a n i g g e r all the time. So how are you going to stop that, then? An answer would be good, RV. How will you stop black men being racist, ie how will you stop them using the N word? Do tell
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Post by Ben Lomond on Aug 20, 2010 19:34:59 GMT
While I would not particularly defend the use of insulting epithets;particularly the term "Nig*er, what I DO find objectionable is the reaction of our society to the use of racial insults. It should never be a criminal offence to insult another person; nor should people be hounded out of their jobs for what is often something said in the heat of the moment.
Nor should anyone be financially compensated because their feelings were allegedly offended. That's all, I guess!
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