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Post by DAS (formerly BushAdmirer) on Aug 22, 2013 13:15:23 GMT
Bradley Manning was sentenced to 35 years in prison for treasonous actions (A very light sentence in my opinion). Now this: Bradley Manning says he wants to live as a woman FORT MEADE, Md. (AP) — Bradley Manning plans to live as a woman named Chelsea and wants to begin hormone therapy as soon as possible, the soldier said Thursday, a day after being sentenced to 35 years in prison for sending classified material to WikiLeaks. Manning announced the decision in a written statement provided to NBC's "Today" show, asking supporters to refer to him by his new name and the feminine pronoun. The statement was signed "Chelsea E. Manning." "As I transition into this next phase of my life, I want everyone to know the real me. I am Chelsea Manning. I am a female. Given the way that I feel, and have felt since childhood, I want to begin hormone therapy as soon as possible," the statement read. Manning's defense attorney David Coombs told "Today" in an interview that he is hoping officials at the military prison in Fort Leavenworth, Kan., will accommodate Manning's request for hormone therapy. "If Fort Leavenworth does not, then I'm going to do everything in my power to make sure they are forced to do so," Coombs said. Coombs did not respond to phone and email messages from The Associated Press on Thursday. Manning's struggle with gender identity disorder — the sense of being a woman trapped in a man's body — was key to the defense. Attorneys had presented evidence of Manning's struggle with gender identity, including a photo of the soldier in a blond wig and lipstick sent to a therapist. Meanwhile, the fight to free Manning has taken a new turn, with Coombs and supporters saying they will ask the Army for leniency — and the White House for a pardon. Even Manning's supporters have pivoted. During the sentencing hearing Wednesday, they wore T-shirts reading, "truth," as they had for the entire court-martial. Hours later, they had changed into shirts saying, "President Obama: Pardon Bradley Manning." Here is an undated photo of Manning wearing a wig and lipstick
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Post by Hunny on Aug 22, 2013 14:29:05 GMT
How does he figure he'll be able to "force" the army to pay for a sex change? Does he have a right to health care in jail, and wants this to be deemed a medical necessity? Does that have a chance in court?
*shakes head* I dont know what jail is actually like, but i have this image of her sitting in a cage all day long for years and years, occasionally getting sodomized, and...I guess my question is do convicts experience jail as being in a society? Is it a life? to have? (So is it worth it to go to all the trouble of changing his sex?)
And will this mean he gets moved to a women's prison, perhaps after his genitals have been reassigned? How do they handle that?
What an unfortunate individual!
I just cant imagine the army paying for a sex change!
And I cant imagine it being worth pursuing when spending one's life in a cage with an open toilet.
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Post by Hunny on Aug 22, 2013 14:42:54 GMT
Oh...and I'd be a little more supportive of busting people for "treason" IF those at the very top who commit similarly high crimes all the time were getting busted too. I see an awful lot of subversion in the political process and wonder why it's allowed. And i see presidents breaking laws to take us to war without Congress approving it. And etc. and etc. Haliburton. And when do those who let their buddies off for big crimes get busted because THAT is a big crime too?
This guy's just another Martha Stewart to me. I question the legitimacy of those in power being fit to charge and pass sentence on others lower down on the chain.
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Post by sadie1263 on Aug 22, 2013 14:54:58 GMT
Well....his/her lawyer said today that Chelsea doesn't want the surgery.....just the hormone therapy....or at least at this point......I believe they should have necessary medical care......but I don't see how this would fall into that category........
I agree that everyone.....should be held to the same standard. You are right, Hunny....they aren't. I am undecided how I feel about this case. At first I thought this was just a case of a whistleblower......but he released hundreds of thousands of documents.....there is no way all of them were read to make sure nothing that would harm people was read......also....why not release it to the media here.....why Wikileaks? I don't believe Wikileaks would try and protect innocent lives.....they seem to have more of an agenda to do harm
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Post by Hunny on Aug 22, 2013 15:21:36 GMT
Well....his/her lawyer said today that Chelsea doesn't want the surgery.....just the hormone therapy....or at least at this point......I believe they should have necessary medical care......but I don't see how this would fall into that category........ Well, forgoing the surgery is an option. He can still live as a she, and. there are guys that are attracted to that, so she could get a date even. But I think you're right; it probably wont be deemed as medically necessary. However there are actually cities where if you work for the government, you have health care that will pay for all of it. And in my state we passed a law saying that transgenders have equal rights, and should be provided with public toilets that are gender neutral, to avoid trouble. And so, as the individual states have been legalizing gay marriage, so also have transgenders been gaining some public acceptance or at least acknowledgment (as being human beings rather than perverts who should perhaps be killed.) But this is a long road. She could make a huge case of this and actually force some progress in that endeavor. The problem with it being deemed as medically necessary rests on both the medical community declaring it officially a disorder that requires treatment, and then the insurance companies conforming to that new data. And that's in progress. Society is changing in how it views and treats the "BLT" people (I shouldnt call them that!)(well there's too many letters!!) ok it's GLBTI and I'm now told they wish to add another letter to that, which is overboard, but they want to be recognized, and they DONT want to be lumped into one group. (like calling them all "queers" was doing to them) They are in different situations. For example the 'I' stands for intersex. These are people born with mixed genitalia. That's entirely different than simply being attracted to the same sex, or from finding your body and your emotions are not the same sex. And let the fundamentalists try and say they actually "chose" that situation! But.. I ramble on....it's morning and i have a good coffee buzz, forgive me
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Post by DAS (formerly BushAdmirer) on Aug 23, 2013 0:50:10 GMT
Hunny said: "Well, forgoing the surgery is an option. He can still live as a she, and. there are guys that are attracted to that, so she could get a date even."
Don't agree. I think almost all guys are totally repulsed by that. I wouldn't even want to be in the same room with him/her.
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Post by ♫anna♫ on Aug 23, 2013 3:15:29 GMT
Bradley Manning is a patriot, who showed how the government is no longer accountable to the US people and is engaging in all these expensive and wrongful military adventures, etc. that are not in the interests of the American people!
I'm certain that those who have taken control of the US government have studied Bradley Manning and are interested in discrediting him! If the technology exists to psychologically alter those who challenge the system this technology will be used!
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Post by Hunny on Aug 23, 2013 3:19:05 GMT
Hunny said: "Well, forgoing the surgery is an option. He can still live as a she, and. there are guys that are attracted to that, so she could get a date even." Don't agree. I think almost all guys are totally repulsed by that. I wouldn't even want to be in the same room with him/her. "Her". And the existence of tranny porn suggests there's a demographic for it.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 23, 2013 9:14:58 GMT
Prisoners don't loose all their rights and this looks as though it is one right he might be able to pursue. After all certainly in this country prisoners have the right to the same medical care as everyone else plus an even better education than the rest of us , ie being able to do a free degree etc that is an interesting point Hunny about would they move him/her to a female prison , i guess they might have to.
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Post by sadie1263 on Aug 23, 2013 18:58:23 GMT
The same standard of care......but going thru this a sex change wouldn't fall under that......would it. Wouldn't it be elective?
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Post by Hunny on Aug 24, 2013 0:02:43 GMT
I did some reading...
I didnt think there were any laws that say the government or an employer or an insurance company has to provide treatment for gender dysphoria. But the American Medical Association lists it as a bonafide medical condition, so there are people and organizations (including the ACLU and the Human Rights Commission) who feel therefore it's arbitrary and prejudiced to deny treatment as if it's merely elective or somehow not actually real in spite of its official classification.
And believe it or not, if she tries to commit suicide or tries to castrate herself with some wire while she's in there, she'll actually be improving her chances of having her case classified as 'medically necessary'. That would improve her chances.
Yes, wire. (That's gotta hurt!
Should we make people have to do such things in order to show that it's serious?
Yahoo reports that Manning's attorney "vowed to "do everything in my power to make sure that they are forced" to ensure Manning is provided with the hormone treatment, suggesting a lawsuit could be in the offing if the military doesn't comply."
It said "As of last year, civilian federal prisons are required to develop treatment plans — including hormone therapy, if necessary — for inmates diagnosed with gender identity disorder.."
And it said.."Transgender veterans can get help with hormone therapy and mental health counseling from the Veterans Administration after they leave the military."
But the military prison seems to be free to say no we dont do that here.
So I'm thinking a court battle would be about trying to change what's allowed, based on what is known, and based on is Manning genuinely suffering and could be helped but the military is depriving her of the help?...and is it really ok for the military to singly opt out of handling this in the way that's become the norm elsewhere?
They'd be trying to show that the military is unnecesarily inflicting hardship and should be ordered to not do so.
Yet still the question begs, is it really worth it to her to do this in prison? If she gets hormones, she wont get surgery or hair removal or even be allowed to wear a wig or a bra. So what is Manning hoping to achieve? Well...she could get out in as little as 7 years (don't know how likely that is, but) she could make quite a bit of progress 'transitioning', even just with the hormones alone. (Seven years of that will actually make her body female (minus a uterus), with the right shape and soft shiny skin and all. A transgender has to go through 7 years of hormone therapy to achieve that. Manning could get this done, while she sits in a cell.
And work on the other parts of the process after she gets out.
That's probably what she has in mind.
But again, is she likely to be released in 7 years, given the charges? Well, she'll be eligible to try at that point.
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