|
Post by toby on Jun 24, 2012 16:05:14 GMT
Syn posted.;-There are plenty of rational reasons for not allowing private citizens to decide themselves on the spot guilt and punishment, why it is for the legal system to do this.
Toby comments.;- Yet you would take an 18 year old youth, put a uniform on him , send him to a foreign land and expect him to make such decisions and the legal system is never involved, is it ?
|
|
|
Post by toby on Jun 24, 2012 16:07:42 GMT
Jumbo posted.:-hardly hon. there are stringent requirements for obtaining a handgun, and even more stringent requirement for a concealed carry permit thankfully, more and more states are becoming civilized enough to comprehend that a pencil on my desk is worth more than a thief's life
Toby comments.;- Since Nevada brought in the concealed carry law, Burglaries, Muggings dropped by around 80%. That's good enough for me !
|
|
|
Post by iamjumbo on Jun 25, 2012 9:59:37 GMT
Jumbo posted.:-hardly hon. there are stringent requirements for obtaining a handgun, and even more stringent requirement for a concealed carry permit thankfully, more and more states are becoming civilized enough to comprehend that a pencil on my desk is worth more than a thief's life Toby comments.;- Since Nevada brought in the concealed carry law, Burglaries, Muggings dropped by around 80%. That's good enough for me ! that's the case everywhere that people are armed. criminals are killed, and the rest decide to move on to a less civilized place we have two or three heartwarming stories of good citizens exterminating trash every month here
|
|
|
Post by trubble on Jun 25, 2012 10:47:04 GMT
Link?
|
|
|
Post by toby on Jun 25, 2012 11:15:19 GMT
Trubble posted.:-Link?
Toby comments.:- Not necessary, the last time I was in Las Vegas I was in conversation with a Businessman who showed me his Walther PPK and he told me he felt much better being able to protect himself, he mentioned the 80% drop in Muggings/Burglaries !
So there you are, straight from the Horses Mouth !
|
|
|
Post by Hunny on Jun 25, 2012 11:23:20 GMT
Trubble posted.:-Link? Toby comments.:- Not necessary, the last time I was in Las Vegas I was in conversation with a Businessman who showed me his Walther PPK and he told me he felt much better being able to protect himself, he mentioned the 80% drop in Muggings/Burglaries ! So there you are, straight from the Horses Mouth ! That's just heresay.QUOTE/ (concealed carry) laws reduce violent crime by 4 to 7 percent... (but)the laws increase property crime by 2 to 9 percent. ...the passage of these laws causes criminals to shift from committing violent crime to committing property crime, where...they are less likely to be shot since the victim is frequently not present when the crime occurs. Thus we see violent crime decreasing by 3.5 percent and murders falling by more than twice that percentage, while property crime rises by more than 5 percent.\UNQUOTE source: www.brookings.edu/press/books/chapter_1/evaluatinggunpolicy.pdfQUOTE/Nevada crime statistics indicate a total upward trend in crime based on data from 10 years when violent crime was increasing and property crime was increasing....the crime rate in Nevada for 2012 is expected to be higher than in 2009 when the state violent crime rate was higher than the national violent crime rate average by 22.06% and the state property crime rate was higher than the national property crime rate average by 23.33%. \UNQUOTE source: www.cityrating.com/crime-statistics/nevada/______________________________________________________________ ADDITIONAL INFO: Here also are the stats to 2008: cdclv.unlv.edu/healthnv_2012/crime.pdfAnd as for the law change you refer to: apps.carryconcealed.net/legal/nevada-ccw-state-laws.php ..Okay, so in 2007 they legislated that individual towns (like Las Vegas) can't countermand the state law that you can carry concealed. ______________________________________________________________ Perhaps there was a larger initial drop within the city of Las Vegas (if there was), but I submit you've shown no statistics of it, and even if you were to, Las Vegas is unusual in being a city where a lot of gambling is going on, so this is certainly not representative of the average reduction in violent crime rates caused by the introduction of Concealed Carry. Plus, as noted, when violent crimes go down, property crime goes up, so overall crime stays the same. No reduction is accomplished by secretly arming the populace.
|
|
|
Post by trubble on Jun 25, 2012 16:27:18 GMT
Trubble posted.:-Link? Toby comments.:- Not necessary, the last time I was in Las Vegas I was in conversation with a Businessman who showed me his Walther PPK and he told me he felt much better being able to protect himself, he mentioned the 80% drop in Muggings/Burglaries ! So there you are, straight from the Horses Mouth ! Flippin' heck, another 2 IQ points I can never get back. This is becoming dangerous.
|
|
|
Post by iamjumbo on Jun 25, 2012 17:43:54 GMT
Trubble posted.:-Link? Toby comments.:- Not necessary, the last time I was in Las Vegas I was in conversation with a Businessman who showed me his Walther PPK and he told me he felt much better being able to protect himself, he mentioned the 80% drop in Muggings/Burglaries ! So there you are, straight from the Horses Mouth ! That's just heresay.QUOTE/ (concealed carry) laws reduce violent crime by 4 to 7 percent... (but)the laws increase property crime by 2 to 9 percent. ...the passage of these laws causes criminals to shift from committing violent crime to committing property crime, where...they are less likely to be shot since the victim is frequently not present when the crime occurs. Thus we see violent crime decreasing by 3.5 percent and murders falling by more than twice that percentage, while property crime rises by more than 5 percent.\UNQUOTE source: www.brookings.edu/press/books/chapter_1/evaluatinggunpolicy.pdfQUOTE/Nevada crime statistics indicate a total upward trend in crime based on data from 10 years when violent crime was increasing and property crime was increasing....the crime rate in Nevada for 2012 is expected to be higher than in 2009 when the state violent crime rate was higher than the national violent crime rate average by 22.06% and the state property crime rate was higher than the national property crime rate average by 23.33%. \UNQUOTE source: www.cityrating.com/crime-statistics/nevada/______________________________________________________________ ADDITIONAL INFO: Here also are the stats to 2008: cdclv.unlv.edu/healthnv_2012/crime.pdfAnd as for the law change you refer to: apps.carryconcealed.net/legal/nevada-ccw-state-laws.php ..Okay, so in 2007 they legislated that individual towns (like Las Vegas) can't countermand the state law that you can carry concealed. ______________________________________________________________ Perhaps there was a larger initial drop within the city of Las Vegas (if there was), but I submit you've shown no statistics of it, and even if you were to, Las Vegas is unusual in being a city where a lot of gambling is going on, so this is certainly not representative of the average reduction in violent crime rates caused by the introduction of Concealed Carry. Plus, as noted, when violent crimes go down, property crime goes up, so overall crime stays the same. No reduction is accomplished by secretly arming the populace. when criminals die, crime goes down proportionately
|
|