♫anna♫
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Post by ♫anna♫ on Aug 13, 2009 3:32:12 GMT
www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,539147,00.html QUOTE: Falling trumpets creationism issue by: BRIAN BARBER World Staff Writer Wednesday, August 12, 2009 8/12/2009 9:55:17 AM Republican mayoral candidate Anna Falling said Tuesday that putting a Christian creationism display in the Tulsa Zoo is No. 1 in importance among city issues that also include violent crime, budget woes and bumpy streets. "It's first," she said to calls of "hallelujah" at a rally outside the zoo. "If we can't come to the foundation of faith in this community, those other answers will never come. We need to first of all recognize the fact that God needs to be honored in this city." Falling, who has founded several Christian nonprofit groups and is a former city councilor, also said the next mayor needs to appoint people to boards, authorities and commissions who will "honor God." "We will also look for people who want to characterize the origins of both man and animals in a way that honors Judeo-Christian science that proves God as the creator," she said. When asked whether she meant that she would recruit Christians to serve the city, Falling said she was talking about "people committed to their churches." When asked whether she meant Christian churches, she said, "churches, yes." Falling's campaign has been overtly Christian-themed. But she said she wants to embrace people of all religions, not alienate them. "I'd love to be able to visit with them," she said, adding that there's common ground. "I know God loves them. I love them. This is an opportunity for us to be able to be friends and make a difference in this community." Controversy over having a creationism display at the zoo dates to 2005, when it was proposed by Dan Hicks, a Christian activist. Hicks drew up plans for a 5-by-3-foot panel that would tell the Genesis creation story of God creating the world in six days and resting on the seventh. It was initially approved by the Tulsa Park and Recreation Board, but the board later rescinded its decision in a second vote after a public outcry. Hicks' now-finished panel was on display at the rally. Zoo officials released this prepared statement: "Installation of this exhibit at the Tulsa Zoo was raised in 2005, discussed, vetted and resolved in a very public process involving the entire community. A public vote four years ago by the Parks Board resolved the issue." The zoo has on display an elephantlike sculpture said to depict the Hindu god Ganesha and an exhibit that deals with the creation of the earth from a scientific point of view.
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Post by clemiethedog on Sept 16, 2009 12:34:33 GMT
Those Christian fundis need to be thrown into zoo cages because of their ignorance.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2009 15:58:30 GMT
For heavens sake! Is she saying that Christians who believe in evolution can't honour God?
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Post by Ben Lomond on Sept 16, 2009 17:25:54 GMT
Looks like the lunatics are well on their way to taking over the asylum!
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♫anna♫
Global Moderator
Aug 18 2017 - Always In Our Hearts
The Federal Reserve Act is the Betrayal of the American Revolution!
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karma:
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Post by ♫anna♫ on Sept 22, 2009 14:44:59 GMT
Those Christian fundis need to be thrown into zoo cages because of their ignorance. The same bigotry was behind the imprisonment of Galileo, when he claimed the earth was round!
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Post by beth on Sept 23, 2009 2:56:21 GMT
They can be pretty insufferable, anna. The fundies are a distinct minority among Christians in the U. S. and elsewhere. Zealots, might be a good descriptive word. Many fundamentalists demonstrate very harsh attitudes. When we read about children dying from lack of medical care for their illness, the parents are often part of one of the fundie groups. It isn't so much what they believe as their practices and attitudes. Believe me, the deep prejudices fundies show toward others (including Jews and RCs) is far beyond any bias shown toward them.
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♫anna♫
Global Moderator
Aug 18 2017 - Always In Our Hearts
The Federal Reserve Act is the Betrayal of the American Revolution!
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karma:
Posts: 11,769
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Post by ♫anna♫ on Sept 23, 2009 22:13:16 GMT
They can be pretty insufferable, anna. The fundies are a distinct minority among Christians in the U. S. and elsewhere. Zealots, might be a good descriptive word. Many fundamentalists demonstrate very harsh attitudes. When we read about children dying from lack of medical care for their illness, the parents are often part of one of the fundie groups. It isn't so much what they believe as their practices and attitudes. Believe me, the deep prejudices fundies show toward others (including Jews and RCs) is far beyond any bias shown toward them. I disagree with some ideas often associated with the Fundamentalists! We have at least one thread on a child's death resulting from their refusal to seek medical help and opting for prayer. biglinmarshall.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=ethics&action=display&thread=638Still in a free country based on free speech and open debates we have to let those who are wrong have the chance or the right to be proven wrong publicly and not silenced by dictatorial censorship!
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Post by Liberator on Sept 24, 2009 0:59:31 GMT
According to Hindu mythology the 184 million (or whatever) species of 'creature' were created by the 184 million positions of sexual intercourse between Śiwa and Parvatii, daughter of the Himaalaya. (It's all those extra arms and legs I guess!) So let's see a Hindu Creationist park dedicated to that! What the hell were they doing to produce the Aardvark and the Warthog and that South American thing with holes in its upper lips for the lower tusks to go through? ;D
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Post by beth on Sept 24, 2009 1:43:48 GMT
According to Hindu mythology the 184 million (or whatever) species of 'creature' were created by the 184 million positions of sexual intercourse between Śiwa and Parvatii, daughter of the Himaalaya. (It's all those extra arms and legs I guess!) So let's see a Hindu Creationist park dedicated to that! What the hell were they doing to produce the Aardvark and the Warthog and that South American thing with holes in its upper lips for the lower tusks to go through? ;D
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Post by beth on Sept 24, 2009 1:55:44 GMT
They can be pretty insufferable, anna. The fundies are a distinct minority among Christians in the U. S. and elsewhere. Zealots, might be a good descriptive word. Many fundamentalists demonstrate very harsh attitudes. When we read about children dying from lack of medical care for their illness, the parents are often part of one of the fundie groups. It isn't so much what they believe as their practices and attitudes. Believe me, the deep prejudices fundies show toward others (including Jews and RCs) is far beyond any bias shown toward them. I disagree with some ideas often associated with the Fundamentalists! We have at least one thread on a child's death resulting from their refusal to seek medical help and opting for prayer. biglinmarshall.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=ethics&action=display&thread=638Still in a free country based on free speech and open debates we have to let those who are wrong have the chance or the right to be proven wrong publicly and not silenced by dictatorial censorship! It just goes back to the old question that's been around as long as I've traveled discussion boards (eons it sometimes seems) - Is it wrong to be biased toward bigots? H*ll no, I say. These people influence children. They actually do harm. We can't stop them - except one at a time as they break the law of the land - but we can speak out against them. With all their zealousness, they make a mockery of Christianity and common humanity.
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♫anna♫
Global Moderator
Aug 18 2017 - Always In Our Hearts
The Federal Reserve Act is the Betrayal of the American Revolution!
e x a l t | s m i t e
karma:
Posts: 11,769
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Post by ♫anna♫ on Sept 24, 2009 6:22:55 GMT
I disagree with some ideas often associated with the Fundamentalists! We have at least one thread on a child's death resulting from their refusal to seek medical help and opting for prayer. biglinmarshall.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=ethics&action=display&thread=638Still in a free country based on free speech and open debates we have to let those who are wrong have the chance or the right to be proven wrong publicly and not silenced by dictatorial censorship! It just goes back to the old question that's been around as long as I've traveled discussion boards (eons it sometimes seems) - Is it wrong to be biased toward bigots? H*ll no, I say. These people influence children. They actually do harm. We can't stop them - except one at a time as they break the law of the land - but we can speak out against them. With all their zealousness, they make a mockery of Christianity and common humanity. "Bigots" are often victims of other bigots. If the Romans and others didn't mass murder Christians than i can't imagine the Crusades, the Medieval Inquisition and other bigoted reactions occuring. In the circle of bigotry someone has to rise above the circle, instead of continuing it.
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Post by beth on Sept 24, 2009 13:18:33 GMT
I think our difference here is that you're looking at it from an historic sweep, I'm standing much closer. If we hug up to those who are doing wrong - causing pain, etc. - aren't we acting as their enablers?
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♫anna♫
Global Moderator
Aug 18 2017 - Always In Our Hearts
The Federal Reserve Act is the Betrayal of the American Revolution!
e x a l t | s m i t e
karma:
Posts: 11,769
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Post by ♫anna♫ on Sept 24, 2009 13:41:32 GMT
I think our difference here is that you're looking at it from an historic sweep, I'm standing much closer. If we hug up to those who are doing wrong - causing pain, etc. - aren't we acting as their enablers? Criminals in the true sense of the word must be prosecuted, regardless of their "world view". People however should always be free to hold "controversial or even mistaken opinions", without punishment.
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Post by beth on Sept 26, 2009 0:01:23 GMT
Anna, I see your point and of course you are right as far as it goes. However, I also think opposite views should be equally allowed. For example, neo-nazis can say what they want, but those who are in fierce disagreement should be able to say so, publicly or privately. This is assuming none of the above will include defamation, slander or libel. Still, I must say that we have a moral/ethical duty to speak out when we see and hear things that seem to be wrong and/or put others in harms way. Like you, I would not want to oppress those who have different views from my own, but when they are attempting to oppress, they should be called on it.
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♫anna♫
Global Moderator
Aug 18 2017 - Always In Our Hearts
The Federal Reserve Act is the Betrayal of the American Revolution!
e x a l t | s m i t e
karma:
Posts: 11,769
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Post by ♫anna♫ on Sept 26, 2009 6:00:42 GMT
Anna, I see your point and of course you are right as far as it goes. However, I also think opposite views should be equally allowed. For example, neo-nazis can say what they want, but those who are in fierce disagreement should be able to say so, publicly or privately. This is assuming none of the above will include defamation, slander or libel. Still, I must say that we have a moral/ethical duty to speak out when we see and hear things that seem to be wrong and/or put others in harms way. Like you, I would not want to oppress those who have different views from my own, but when they are attempting to oppress, they should be called on it. There are of course limits to free speech! Free speech does not protect for example the incitement to murder or the promotion of pedophilia and child pornography! I feel it's a good exercise though to be able to debate adherents of say totalitarian systems in a relaxed and civil manner. It's just like a chess game and we can just calmly checkmate the extremists, without emotional theatrics! Of course i understand that those, whose families have suffered under totalitarianism and extremism can hardly be expected to treat the minions of tyranny in this fashion.
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Post by beth on Sept 26, 2009 15:43:14 GMT
Quote: I feel it's a good exercise though to be able to debate adherents of say totalitarian systems in a relaxed and civil manner. It's just like a chess game and we can just calmly checkmate the extremists, without emotional theatrics!
Yes - this is what a friend of mine calls, "baffle them with logic". There's a difference between people who have good intentions but adhere to customs and beliefs we'd never consider, (aka not being able to see the forest for looking at the trees. ha!) and others who may be out to do deliberate harm.
Quote: Of course i understand that those, whose families have suffered under totalitarianism and extremism can hardly be expected to treat the minions of tyranny in this fashion.
I think many who get involved with groups that seek to make unconventional demands on members (no doctors, snake handling, other fundie fringe practices) may go that route in hopes of acquiring a little power. IOW, many of these folks feel powerless, even weak, and join a group where there is strength in numbers.
Of course, I also think that is how cults are formed.
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Post by gabriel on Sept 27, 2009 7:02:45 GMT
My question is, do they realise, according to their reasoning, that we would all be the result of incest? I mean, Eve had 2 sons so for a new generation to evolve she would have had to...you get the drift. Then the incest and inbreeding would have had to continue and so on.
Maybe that explains a few people I've met in my life.
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Post by beth on Sept 27, 2009 16:05:58 GMT
My question is, do they realise, according to their reasoning, that we would all be the result of incest? I mean, Eve had 2 sons so for a new generation to evolve she would have had to...you get the drift. Then the incest and inbreeding would have had to continue and so on. Maybe that explains a few people I've met in my life. Good reasoning, but don't forget the "other people" - obviously the folks who lived in the domain of other gods. (starting after God discovered Cain had slain Abel) King James Version And now art thou cursed from the earth, which hath opened her mouth to receive thy brother's blood from thy hand.
12 When thou tillest the ground, it shall not henceforth yield unto thee her strength; a fugitive and a vagabond shalt thou be in the earth. 13 And Cain said unto the LORD, My punishment is greater than I can bear. 14 Behold, thou hast driven me out this day from the face of the earth; and from thy face shall I be hid; and I shall be a fugitive and a vagabond in the earth; and it shall come to pass, that every one that findeth me shall slay me. 15 And the LORD said unto him, Therefore whosoever slayeth Cain, vengeance shall be taken on him sevenfold. And the LORD set a mark upon Cain, lest any finding him should kill him. 16 And Cain went out from the presence of the LORD, and dwelt in the land of Nod, on the east of Eden. 17 ¶ And Cain knew his wife; and she conceived, and bare Enoch: and he builded a city, and called the name of the city, after the name of his son, Enoch.
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