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Post by fretslider on May 14, 2010 17:18:43 GMT
Amy Owen, 14, and several of her friends at Ellesmere Port Catholic High School in Cheshire refused to go on a visit to a mosque after being told that they had to conform to a Muslim dress code involving covering their heads and wearing long skirts or leggings. Her mother, Michelle Davies, received a letter from the headmaster, Peter Lee, insisting that the trip to the al-Rahma mosque in Toxteth, Liverpool, was compulsory because of rules promoting “community cohesion”.
The letter, parts of which were underlined and written in capital letters, also suggested that a failure to do so might see it marked down in an Ofsted inspection. A teacher then telephoned Miss Owen telling her that if her daughter did not go on the trip, organised by the Religious Education department, it would be marked down as an "unauthorised absence" even after she had refused to sign a parental consent form. “It's like they're putting a gun to your head, either you go to a mosque, or you're marked down as an unauthorised absence on your record, that's it no two ways about it,” said Miss Davies. “It's like they are saying she is playing truant for not wearing a headscarf.
Miss Davies said the objection was for “religious reasons”, she admitted: I'm not a devout Catholic, I've never claimed to be but my daughter is a white, British Catholic girl - not a Muslim girl, therefore she is not adhering to a Muslim dress code." In his letter, Mr Lee insisted that the visit was as compulsory as a geography field trip. “The school is REQUIRED to promote tolerance respect and understanding,” he wrote.
“This is known as community cohesion. A failure to do this could result in an unwelcome inspection judgment. None of us would relish that.” Miss Davies claimed that up to 10 other Year Nine girls had also refused to go on the trip for the same reason. Among them was Charlie Sheen, 14. Her mother, Kirsty Ashworth, said: “I didn’t see the educational benefit of it.”
Its yet another bend-over exercise.
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2010 19:46:57 GMT
We used to go on useless trips; my most memorable was a visit to the Shippams Paste Factory. I'd have loved to have seen a mosque.
For goodness sake, what silly girls; just as daft as the ones who insist on wearing veils.
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Post by fretslider on May 14, 2010 20:27:52 GMT
There is a law..... Parents have the right to withdraw their child from all RE or part of it regardless of the type of Church school. The right of withdrawal is always available even if parents have signed a form to the contrary prior to their child's acceptance at the school. Guidance regarding the right of the parent to withdraw their child from religious education can be found in the Department for Education Circular 1/94 paragraphs 44-49. FAQs Can parents withdraw their children from part of the RE curriculum? Yes. Who looks after those who are withdrawn? The school is required to ensure the safety of the pupil but not required to provide alternative teaching. www.natsoc.org.uk/schools/curriculum/re/re7.html
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Post by randomvioce on May 14, 2010 22:57:15 GMT
We used to go on useless trips; my most memorable was a visit to the Shippams Paste Factory. I'd have loved to have seen a mosque. No matter what, you where expected to follow a dress code, whenever yo go somewhere. These young girls were expected to cover their hair, arms and legs. Not dress 'like Muslims. Of course if the catholic church issued a modest dress code, it may keep priests out of the arses of young boys.
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Post by mouse on May 15, 2010 13:50:15 GMT
the part i have a problem with is the ..compulsion... In his letter, Mr Lee insisted that the visit was as compulsory as a geography field trip.""" can anyone tell me how geography includes a trip to a mosque or church ?? then there is this “This is known as community cohesion. A failure to do this could result in an unwelcome inspection judgment. None of us would relish that.”"" just another word for social engineering with big brother ready to crack the whip on those who dare disoby....now are muslim pupils required to atend synogogues and churches also in the name of comunity cohesion......are they required to listen while athiests put forward their views...its all too one sided for my taste
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Post by sadie1263 on May 15, 2010 14:09:06 GMT
Ok....fine....they didn't want to go.....don't friggin' go......
But what a small world you make for yourself when you don't experience other cultures and other ways of life and other perspectives. I'm not saying you jump in and join.........but you can learn so much......and broaden your horizons.
If I were to go to a factory to see where something was made....and they required you to wear overalls and masks......what exactly would be the difference?
I think they missed out on a learning opportunity.
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Post by fretslider on May 15, 2010 14:20:42 GMT
Ok....fine....they didn't want to go.....don't friggin' go...... But what a small world you make for yourself when you don't experience other cultures and other ways of life and other perspectives. I'm not saying you jump in and join.........but you can learn so much......and broaden your horizons. If I were to go to a factory to see where something was made....and they required you to wear overalls and masks......what exactly would be the difference? I think they missed out on a learning opportunity. Sadie, Sadie, Sadie, It really isn't as simple as that, of only it were. The pattern is one of a subjugation of our culture to satisfy and appease a small minority. That encourages resentment. You integrate people, the UK does not.
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Post by sadie1263 on May 15, 2010 14:28:49 GMT
Then take the unexcused absence and take your kid to the movies. I would be cool with that too.
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Post by sadie1263 on May 15, 2010 14:33:56 GMT
If it helps any....then I think all the kids should have to visit all the different religious churches, buildings, etc. Would only be fair.
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Post by randomvioce on May 15, 2010 16:22:36 GMT
Sadie, Sadie, Sadie, It really isn't as simple as that, of only it were. The pattern is one of a subjugation of our culture to satisfy and appease a small minority. That encourages resentment. . Come on fretty, jeans and a hoodie. Not too much to ask, is it. What is wrong with expecting pupils to dress appropriately as the trip asks?
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Post by Deleted on May 15, 2010 17:06:18 GMT
In his letter, Mr Lee insisted that the visit was as compulsory as a geography field trip.""" can anyone tell me how geography includes a trip to a mosque or church ?? Geography has certainly changed since you and I were gals, Mouse! About 10 years ago I met girl who was doing a project on shopping for her GCSE geography; even my OH tells of when he was taken to see a high rise block of flats as part of his geography course.
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Post by mouse on May 15, 2010 17:33:09 GMT
mind bending isnt it skylark...but geography visiting an other part of town !!!!!..oi vey... the past is indeeed another country...not too sure how to describe the present
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Post by mouse on May 15, 2010 17:34:00 GMT
Sadie, Sadie, Sadie, It really isn't as simple as that, of only it were. The pattern is one of a subjugation of our culture to satisfy and appease a small minority. That encourages resentment. . Come on fretty, jeans and a hoodie. Not too much to ask, is it. What is wrong with expecting pupils to dress appropriately as the trip asks? whats wrong with school uniform....??
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Post by fretslider on May 15, 2010 17:44:13 GMT
Sadie, Sadie, Sadie, It really isn't as simple as that, of only it were. The pattern is one of a subjugation of our culture to satisfy and appease a small minority. That encourages resentment. . Come on fretty, jeans and a hoodie. Not too much to ask, is it. What is wrong with expecting pupils to dress appropriately as the trip asks? I knew you'd toe the appeasement line, RV. Religion is a complete waste of everybody's time. As mouse asks, what is wrong with school uniform?
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Post by sadie1263 on May 15, 2010 17:59:25 GMT
I would really have to know what the rest of the curriculum is before I could pass judgement. Like I said......if they are required to go to other religious places......that I don't see the big deal....I would expect them to respect the requirements of each place....if it is only to this one......than I would raise a fuss in all probability.
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Post by mouse on May 15, 2010 18:41:08 GMT
I would really have to know what the rest of the curriculum is before I could pass judgement. Like I said......if they are required to go to other religious places......that I don't see the big deal....I would expect them to respect the requirements of each place....if it is only to this one......than I would raise a fuss in all probability. more interstingly is how geography morphed into RE....mindless totally mindless
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Post by randomvioce on May 15, 2010 19:29:46 GMT
I knew you'd toe the appeasement line Appeasement? get real fretty. These pupils were taken to a field trip and where asked to dress in a manner following the conventions of that place. No different, in principle, to any other request when visiting outwith the school. I would expect any school to observe the dress codes of any organisation thaqt pupils were attending. Be it a war grave or a Nazi Death camp or a battlefield etc, right through to factory or ANY place of worship. I would expect to pupils to dress in an appropriate manner going to a Cathedral so I cannot see the problem. This is typical of you Islamaphobic people. You lose any kind of proportion when someone throws Islam into the mix. You cannot look at this objectively, you have to contort yourselves around any subject to find even the most trivial objection. Really, this shows up the anti Islam people up for the sad little bigots they are and shows that even when Muslims make perfectly reasonable requests, the nutters can conjure up something out of thin air. Well done on this fretty. The Muslim look moderates and the anti Islam people look like nutters AGAIN.
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Post by june on May 15, 2010 21:23:06 GMT
Come on fretty, jeans and a hoodie. Not too much to ask, is it. What is wrong with expecting pupils to dress appropriately as the trip asks? I knew you'd toe the appeasement line, RV. Religion is a complete waste of everybody's time. As mouse asks, what is wrong with school uniform? I see this quite differently. Why should a child be forced to go to any religious establishment they don't want to. As for dressing with hair covered, well it's only polite isn't it. Not so long ago all women in Christian churches wore a hat. They were asked to respect the religious temple not convert to Islam. I'm sure they wouldnt go to a Cathderal in a bikini top and hot pants. What a lot of silly fuss over nothing (unless you count Islam bashing as being a worthwhile endeavour)
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Post by DAS (formerly BushAdmirer) on May 16, 2010 0:40:57 GMT
Frankly I see nothing wrong with covering your head during a school field trip to a Mosque. Granted you may believe that Islam is a bogus religion. Granted you may have zero respect for Islam.
However, it seems rather basic to show (minimal) respect for their beliefs when visiting one of their churches.
When in Rome I visited the Vatican and took the tour. I stood in the middle of St Peter's Basilica. I did not show disrespect even though I don't believe the Catholic version of Christianity has even the slightest validity. It is exactly on par with Islam. Neither of those two religions has even the slightest validity. That's my opinion and I will stand by it. But I realize that both religions have their adherents who are offended if you ridicule their beliefs in public.
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Post by mouse on May 16, 2010 8:54:00 GMT
well no one has come up with a rational answer into how a visit to a mosque is morphed into geography and why pupils are compelled to pay out of their own pokets for a compulasary visit the school needs new organisers
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