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Post by kronks on Jun 13, 2015 4:18:04 GMT
Hope win Ireland v Scotland kick off 5pm Saturday (not too optimistic to tell the truth!!)
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Post by toetapping on Jun 13, 2015 22:03:55 GMT
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Post by mikemarshall on Jun 14, 2015 23:45:53 GMT
Why can you choose your friends but you can't choose your family? (Right now that's a very topical beef with me!) I beg to disagree, they are part of our Karma. Well, you appear to have a contradictory attitude towards the notion of karma. Either karma is a totally deterministic system in which case all ideas of blame or praise are irrelevant since every action was preordained before the person was even born or it involves choice. Clearly children have no choice in the biology of their parents so one can only conclude that you believe new born babies are somehow cursed from birth simply because of alleged offences in previous lifestyles. To me that is an abhorrent attitude; not only does it load a weight of guilt on children's necks that is totally undeserved but it would also mean that the God in whom you claim to believe is not just, not kind, not loving and frankly not very honourable on any level. I tend to agree with John Stuart Mill's comment 'I will call no being good to whom I cannot apply the same word to my fellow man and if such a being can sentence me to hell for not believing in him to hell I will go.'
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Thoughts
Jun 15, 2015 4:14:08 GMT
via mobile
Post by Scottish Lassie on Jun 15, 2015 4:14:08 GMT
[quote author=" mikemarshall" source="/post/65371/thread" timestamp="1434325553"] I beg to disagree, they are part of our Karma. Well, you appear to have a contradictory attitude towards the notion of karma. Either karma is a totally deterministic system in which case all ideas of blame or praise are irrelevant since every action was preordained before the person was even born or it involves choice. Clearly children have no choice in the biology of their parents so one can only conclude that you believe new born babies are somehow cursed from birth simply because of alleged offences in previous lifestyles. To me that is an abhorrent attitude; not only does it load a weight of guilt on children's necks that is totally undeserved but it would also mean that the God in whom you claim to believe is not just, not kind, not loving and frankly not very honourable on any level. I tend to agree with John Stuart Mill's comment 'I will call no being good to whom I cannot apply the same word to my fellow man and if such a being can sentence me to hell for not believing in him to hell I will go.' [/quote] Hi Mike Marshall, You obviously have not undestood what reincarnation is all about, according to how ECKANKAR sees it. When the body gives up the ghost, Soul moves into the dimension that it has earned the right to be. Before it is due to return to this earth the heirarchy takes it aside and they engage in discussion as to what is best for that Soul. Taking into consideration the fact that Karma has been accrued together they work out what family it will be born into so that it has the best chance of learning what it needs to know Evidently, because all Souls are connected through Karma, a group of Souls will come together in orde for that to occur, so each Soul in that family situation, is each working off its Karma and so learning, or it adds more Karma because of unwise choices which are incurred. Things will not change so that Soul can evolve spiritually, until the situatiion between family members is resolved. The aim is always for serenity and goodwill between family members, which will or should take place when the karmic lessons are learned and the situation resolved as a result.
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Post by toetapping on Jun 15, 2015 5:39:11 GMT
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Post by mikemarshall on Jun 15, 2015 21:55:16 GMT
[quote author=" mikemarshall" source="/post/65371/thread" timestamp="1434325553"] I beg to disagree, they are part of our Karma. Well, you appear to have a contradictory attitude towards the notion of karma. Either karma is a totally deterministic system in which case all ideas of blame or praise are irrelevant since every action was preordained before the person was even born or it involves choice. Clearly children have no choice in the biology of their parents so one can only conclude that you believe new born babies are somehow cursed from birth simply because of alleged offences in previous lifestyles. To me that is an abhorrent attitude; not only does it load a weight of guilt on children's necks that is totally undeserved but it would also mean that the God in whom you claim to believe is not just, not kind, not loving and frankly not very honourable on any level. I tend to agree with John Stuart Mill's comment 'I will call no being good to whom I cannot apply the same word to my fellow man and if such a being can sentence me to hell for not believing in him to hell I will go.' Hi Mike Marshall, You obviously have not undestood what reincarnation is all about, according to how ECKANKAR sees it. When the body gives up the ghost, Soul moves into the dimension that it has earned the right to be. Before it is due to return to this earth the heirarchy takes it aside and they engage in discussion as to what is best for that Soul. Taking into consideration the fact that Karma has been accrued together they work out what family it will be born into so that it has the best chance of learning what it needs to know Evidently, because all Souls are connected through Karma, a group of Souls will come together in orde for that to occur, so each Soul in that family situation, is each working off its Karma and so learning, or it adds more Karma because of unwise choices which are incurred. Things will not change so that Soul can evolve spiritually, until the situatiion between family members is resolved. The aim is always for serenity and goodwill between family members, which will or should take place when the karmic lessons are learned and the situation resolved as a result. [/quote] It is not that I do not understand the concept of reincarnation; I simply reject it as being morally repugnant. If a God who is allegedly a being of love is capable of condemning his supposed creation to an endless cycle of rebirth simply to punish them for their alleged faults in their previous lives he is no better morally than the type of sadist who presided over Victorian workhouses or prisons where the inmates were condemned to perform utterly pointless work simply to 'punish' them. Now you may regard that as being morally praiseworthy; leaving aside the atrocities of Hitler, Himmler, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Ngueme and other tyrants one has only to consider the appalling example of 'eugenics' where 'thinkers' such as Galton, Madison Grant and Margaret Sanger called for the compulsory sterilisation of 'lesser breeds' not simply in terms of 'genetic defects' but on the basis of their 'racial inferiority.' Sanger went so far as to write in a letter to one of her disciples 'we must not let the word get out that we mean to exterminate the Negro race.' Grant's book 'The Passing of the Great Race' was the first foreign book translated into German under the Nazis. Hitler met Grant and told him that 'your book is my Bible.' Sanger too earned high praise from Hitler and also admired his 'eugenic programme.' Now to return to karma; either it is beyond the individual's control since his or her destiny is determined by the results of their behaviour in their 'past life' or it is NOT beyond their control. If it is beyond their control all concepts of praise or blame are irrational and no one is, even in principle, capable of 'progressing' since they do not have the capacity to learn or to behave differently. If it is not beyond their control then the whole concept makes no sense since they would have a clean slate and any 'past life' behaviour would be irrelevant. So either they have free will or they do not; if they do then karma fails and if they do not then karma is simply a mechanical force operating in a totally deterministic and mechanistic fashion over which no action or thought of any individual can make a difference. Either way it is irrational, false to the facts of experience and IMO fundamentally immoral and cruel.
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Post by Big Lin on Jun 15, 2015 22:03:06 GMT
Why can you choose your friends but you can't choose your family? (Right now that's a very topical beef with me!) I beg to disagree, they are part of our Karma. Well, I don't believe in all that karma rubbish; it's just a cop out.
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Post by toetapping on Jun 15, 2015 23:38:12 GMT
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Thoughts
Jun 16, 2015 4:55:26 GMT
via mobile
Post by Scottish Lassie on Jun 16, 2015 4:55:26 GMT
I beg to disagree, they are part of our Karma. Well, I don't believe in all that karma rubbish; it's just a cop out. Hi Big Lin, I'm surprised that you don't believe in 'you reap what you sow' seeing that it is written in the Christian Bible. I for one certainly believe it to be true. Does that mean that a criminal type can continue his/her rampage of criminal activity, then when each is ready to repent, Jesus exonerates them from all their wrongdoing, and nobody suffers the consequences of their behaviour. How nice!!! If you ask me, it is that kind of thinking that is the cop out. It would seem to me that no one wants to take responsibility for their behaviour. As far as I am concerned, an adult always takes responsibility for their actions. Allowances are made for children. Haven't you grown up yet? I think you are living a dream.
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Thoughts
Jun 16, 2015 5:41:03 GMT
via mobile
Post by Scottish Lassie on Jun 16, 2015 5:41:03 GMT
[quote author=" mikemarshall" source="/post/65371/thread" timestamp="1434325553"]Well, you appear to have a contradictory attitude towards the notion of karma. Either karma is a totally deterministic system in which case all ideas of blame or praise are irrelevant since every action was preordained before the person was even born or it involves choice. Clearly children have no choice in the biology of their parents so one can only conclude that you believe new born babies are somehow cursed from birth simply because of alleged offences in previous lifestyles. To me that is an abhorrent attitude; not only does it load a weight of guilt on children's necks that is totally undeserved but it would also mean that the God in whom you claim to believe is not just, not kind, not loving and frankly not very honourable on any level. I tend to agree with John Stuart Mill's comment 'I will call no being good to whom I cannot apply the same word to my fellow man and if such a being can sentence me to hell for not believing in him to hell I will go.' Hi Mike Marshall, You obviously have not undestood what reincarnation is all about, according to how ECKANKAR sees it. When the body gives up the ghost, Soul moves into the dimension that it has earned the right to be. Before it is due to return to this earth the heirarchy takes it aside and they engage in discussion as to what is best for that Soul. Taking into consideration the fact that Karma has been accrued together they work out what family it will be born into so that it has the best chance of learning what it needs to know Evidently, because all Souls are connected through Karma, a group of Souls will come together in orde for that to occur, so each Soul in that family situation, is each working off its Karma and so learning, or it adds more Karma because of unwise choices which are incurred. Things will not change so that Soul can evolve spiritually, until the situatiion between family members is resolved. The aim is always for serenity and goodwill between family members, which will or should take place when the karmic lessons are learned and the situation resolved as a result. It is not that I do not understand the concept of reincarnation; I simply reject it as being morally repugnant. If a God who is allegedly a being of love is capable of condemning his supposed creation to an endless cycle of rebirth simply to punish them for their alleged faults in their previous lives he is no better morally than the type of sadist who presided over Victorian workhouses or prisons where the inmates were condemned to perform utterly pointless work simply to 'punish' them. Now you may regard that as being morally praiseworthy; leaving aside the atrocities of Hitler, Himmler, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Ngueme and other tyrants one has only to consider the appalling example of 'eugenics' where 'thinkers' such as Galton, Madison Grant and Margaret Sanger called for the compulsory sterilisation of 'lesser breeds' not simply in terms of 'genetic defects' but on the basis of their 'racial inferiority.' Sanger went so far as to write in a letter to one of her disciples 'we must not let the word get out that we mean to exterminate the Negro race.' Grant's book 'The Passing of the Great Race' was the first foreign book translated into German under the Nazis. Hitler met Grant and told him that 'your book is my Bible.' Sanger too earned high praise from Hitler and also admired his 'eugenic programme.' Now to return to karma; either it is beyond the individual's control since his or her destiny is determined by the results of their behaviour in their 'past life' or it is NOT beyond their control. If it is beyond their control all concepts of praise or blame are irrational and no one is, even in principle, capable of 'progressing' since they do not have the capacity to learn or to behave differently. If it is not beyond their control then the whole concept makes no sense since they would have a clean slate and any 'past life' behaviour would be irrelevant. So either they have free will or they do not; if they do then karma fails and if they do not then karma is simply a mechanical force operating in a totally deterministic and mechanistic fashion over which no action or thought of any individual can make a difference. Either way it is irrational, false to the facts of experience and IMO fundamentally immoral and cruel. [/quote] Hi Mike Marshall, With each incarnation Soul begins from where it left off. Everything is in the makeop of the particular body that it has chosen to occupy, in agreement with the heirarchy before it was reborn into this world. Once again Soul is given the opportunity to climb 'Jacob's Ladder' so to speak ! And therefore being more spiritually evolved.in each incarnation freedom of choice is always the case. It is up to a person how they will proceed. God is a Being of Love, it is the human being who is lacking in love and that is what we have come to learn, which is the reason for our right to choose. If every action was made with love in our hearts, we would have no problems, but the fact is, that it is the choices that are made with hatred in our hearts that is responsible for the world's woes. I am quite happy to reap what I have sown, because I have reached maturity, I will cop it on the chin, whatever it is that I have earned by actions taken in past lives. I have grown up!!!
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Post by Big Lin on Jun 16, 2015 19:15:18 GMT
Well, I don't believe in all that karma rubbish; it's just a cop out. Hi Big Lin, I'm surprised that you don't believe in 'you reap what you sow' seeing that it is written in the Christian Bible. I for one certainly believe it to be true. Does that mean that a criminal type can continue his/her rampage of criminal activity, then when each is ready to repent, Jesus exonerates them from all their wrongdoing, and nobody suffers the consequences of their behaviour. How nice!!! If you ask me, it is that kind of thinking that is the cop out. It would seem to me that no one wants to take responsibility for their behaviour. As far as I am concerned, an adult always takes responsibility for their actions. Allowances are made for children. Haven't you grown up yet? I think you are living a dream. Reap what you sow is NOT the same thing as karma. Karma is determined and how a baby can 'reap' what its supposed parents or whatever generations ago may or may not have done is just total idiocy. The Christian Bible does NOT endorse reincarnation; it speaks of a SINGLE life on earth after which we die and then (it's a bit ambiguous in the Bible but one of two things happens - we either go to sleep till the Last Judgement or we are sent to heaven or hell). Now neither of those things has ANYTHING to do with reincarnation. There is absolutely NO proof of reincarnation while there is quite a lot of evidence to support individual survival of death. Karma means not taking responsibility because if your 'karma' is to have (for example) parents who sexually or physically abuse you then according to karma it's NOT their fault but the child's fault! Now I very much believe that how we act in THIS life is what matters and I couldn't give a monkey's about all the crock of dreck about past lives that are just wishful thinking and have NO practical relevance to anyone's behaviour. Reap what you sow is NOT about karma; it's about acting for the best in THIS life. All this reincarnation malarkey is just a heap of sheka and actually holds BACK people from acting morally.
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Post by mikemarshall on Jun 16, 2015 22:40:34 GMT
Chris, you continue to present opinions as if they were facts.
It simply is NOT a FACT that reincarnation exists; it is a belief.
Facts can be verified or falsified by anyone; private experiences (which appears to be the basis upon which you rest your claims) cannot.
Now it seems both pointless and cruel for a god of love to force people to subject themselves endlessly to a treadmill.
Such a being seems to ordinary humans nothing more than a sadist.
And your last paragraph sounds rather like the Pharisee in the temple at Jerusalem saying how he thanked God he was not like the publican whereas the publican said, 'Lord, be merciful to me a sinner.'
And the Bible says that it was NOT the Pharisee's prayer that was answered.
So on every level your assumptions simply do not constitute either facts or IMO a worthwhile and praiseworthy basis for moral conduct.
Quite the reverse.
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Post by toetapping on Jun 17, 2015 4:31:54 GMT
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Thoughts
Jun 17, 2015 7:18:04 GMT
via mobile
Post by Scottish Lassie on Jun 17, 2015 7:18:04 GMT
Hi Big Lin, I'm surprised that you don't believe in 'you reap what you sow' seeing that it is written in the Christian Bible. I for one certainly believe it to be true. Does that mean that a criminal type can continue his/her rampage of criminal activity, then when each is ready to repent, Jesus exonerates them from all their wrongdoing, and nobody suffers the consequences of their behaviour. How nice!!! If you ask me, it is that kind of thinking that is the cop out. It would seem to me that no one wants to take responsibility for their behaviour. As far as I am concerned, an adult always takes responsibility for their actions. Allowances are made for children. Haven't you grown up yet? I think you are living a dream. Reap what you sow is NOT the same thing as karma. Karma is determined and how a baby can 'reap' what its supposed parents or whatever generations ago may or may not have done is just total idiocy. The Christian Bible does NOT endorse reincarnation; it speaks of a SINGLE life on earth after which we die and then (it's a bit ambiguous in the Bible but one of two things happens - we either go to sleep till the Last Judgement or we are sent to heaven or hell). Now neither of those things has ANYTHING to do with reincarnation. There is absolutely NO proof of reincarnation while there is quite a lot of evidence to support individual survival of death. Karma means not taking responsibility because if your 'karma' is to have (for example) parents who sexually or physically abuse you then according to karma it's NOT their fault but the child's fault! Now I very much believe that how we act in THIS life is what matters and I couldn't give a monkey's about all the crock of dreck about past lives that are just wishful thinking and have NO practical relevance to anyone's behaviour. Reap what you sow is NOT about karma; it's about acting for the best in THIS life. All this reincarnation malarkey is just a heap of sheka and actually holds BACK people from acting morally. Hi Big Lin, ' you reap what you sow ' is the consequence to the action, Karma is the Law, they are therefore one and the same. As such, you would think, that fact alone would prevent a wise person from putting into action anything that would in kind, ricochet back to the perpetrator. I have been shown many past lives, so I know that they are a fact as is reincarnation. I believe there is a verse that says: ' you shall not enter the Kingdom of Heaven except you be BORN AGAIN. There is more than just one dimension that we have to negotiate before we reach the true spiritual realm where God dwells and that takes time. May the Blessings be.
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Thoughts
Jun 17, 2015 7:54:56 GMT
via mobile
blc likes this
Post by Scottish Lassie on Jun 17, 2015 7:54:56 GMT
Chris, you continue to present opinions as if they were facts. It simply is NOT a FACT that reincarnation exists; it is a belief. Facts can be verified or falsified by anyone; private experiences (which appears to be the basis upon which you rest your claims) cannot. Now it seems both pointless and cruel for a god of love to force people to subject themselves endlessly to a treadmill. Such a being seems to ordinary humans nothing more than a sadist. And your last paragraph sounds rather like the Pharisee in the temple at Jerusalem saying how he thanked God he was not like the publican whereas the publican said, 'Lord, be merciful to me a sinner.' And the Bible says that it was NOT the Pharisee's prayer that was answered. So on every level your assumptions simply do not constitute either facts or IMO a worthwhile and praiseworthy basis for moral conduct. Quite the reverse. When are people going to accept responsibility for their actions? We definitely have a publican who doesn't want to accept responsibility, he apparently wants Jesus to relieve him of his responsibility. Poor show!!! We ourselves create the treadmill by our unwillingness to behave in a moral way by being more Godlike in our behaviour, therefore making it necessary for us to come back to this earth plane time and time again. We are here to learn how to prevent being on the treadmill as you choose to perceive what life on this earth is like. I live my life making every effort to behave in a Godlike manner, because I want to earn the right to enter the true spiritual realm by taking responibility for my actions.
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Post by Big Lin on Jun 17, 2015 18:44:15 GMT
Reap what you sow is NOT the same thing as karma. Karma is determined and how a baby can 'reap' what its supposed parents or whatever generations ago may or may not have done is just total idiocy. The Christian Bible does NOT endorse reincarnation; it speaks of a SINGLE life on earth after which we die and then (it's a bit ambiguous in the Bible but one of two things happens - we either go to sleep till the Last Judgement or we are sent to heaven or hell). Now neither of those things has ANYTHING to do with reincarnation. There is absolutely NO proof of reincarnation while there is quite a lot of evidence to support individual survival of death. Karma means not taking responsibility because if your 'karma' is to have (for example) parents who sexually or physically abuse you then according to karma it's NOT their fault but the child's fault! Now I very much believe that how we act in THIS life is what matters and I couldn't give a monkey's about all the crock of dreck about past lives that are just wishful thinking and have NO practical relevance to anyone's behaviour. Reap what you sow is NOT about karma; it's about acting for the best in THIS life. All this reincarnation malarkey is just a heap of sheka and actually holds BACK people from acting morally. Hi Big Lin, ' you reap what you sow ' is the consequence to the action, Karma is the Law, they are therefore one and the same. As such, you would think, that fact alone would prevent a wise person from putting into action anything that would in kind, ricochet back to the perpetrator. I have been shown many past lives, so I know that they are a fact as is reincarnation. I believe there is a verse that says: ' you shall not enter the Kingdom of Heaven except you be BORN AGAIN. There is more than just one dimension that we have to negotiate before we reach the true spiritual realm where God dwells and that takes time. May the Blessings be. Let's try and keep this simple. 1 You do NOT 'know for a fact' that reincarnation exists. A FACT is something that everyone can agree on and that can be proved to EVERYONE beyond any reasonable doubt. You say you were 'shown many past lives' - what you mean is that you had a number of inner, private experiences which as such CAN'T be fact because they're subjective and FACTS are open to us all to verify or falsify. The verse in the Bible you quote is NOT talking about reincarnation; it's talking about being spiritually reborn and becoming a better person who tries to live in Christ. 2 'Reap what you sow' refers to and by definition implies freedom of choice to do good or evil. Karma is quite different since it lays predestined burdens on innocent babies for their alleged past lives. So karma means that free will is impossible and so there's no point in blaming or praising people for any action since everything they do is beyond their control. No one is to blame; only that bar steward karma who seems to be a sadistic nut who enjoys hurting people! And none of us knows if there is a world beyond this one and if there is none of us knows anything about it. There are theories and some evidence but the overwhelming majority of evidence on the question of life after death supports the idea of a SINGLE self experiencing PERSONAL immortality and NOT the reincarnation tosh.
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Post by toetapping on Jun 18, 2015 4:05:21 GMT
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Thoughts
Jun 18, 2015 9:46:15 GMT
via mobile
Post by Scottish Lassie on Jun 18, 2015 9:46:15 GMT
Hi Big Lin, ' you reap what you sow ' is the consequence to the action, Karma is the Law, they are therefore one and the same. As such, you would think, that fact alone would prevent a wise person from putting into action anything that would in kind, ricochet back to the perpetrator. I have been shown many past lives, so I know that they are a fact as is reincarnation. I believe there is a verse that says: ' you shall not enter the Kingdom of Heaven except you be BORN AGAIN. There is more than just one dimension that we have to negotiate before we reach the true spiritual realm where God dwells and that takes time. May the Blessings be. Let's try and keep this simple. 1 You do NOT 'know for a fact' that reincarnation exists. A FACT is something that everyone can agree on and that can be proved to EVERYONE beyond any reasonable doubt. You say you were 'shown many past lives' - what you mean is that you had a number of inner, private experiences which as such CAN'T be fact because they're subjective and FACTS are open to us all to verify or falsify. The verse in the Bible you quote is NOT talking about reincarnation; it's talking about being spiritually reborn and becoming a better person who tries to live in Christ. 2 'Reap what you sow' refers to and by definition implies freedom of choice to do good or evil. Karma is quite different since it lays predestined burdens on innocent babies for their alleged past lives. So karma means that free will is impossible and so there's no point in blaming or praising people for any action since everything they do is beyond their control. No one is to blame; only that bar steward karma who seems to be a sadistic nut who enjoys hurting people! And none of us knows if there is a world beyond this one and if there is none of us knows anything about it. There are theories and some evidence but the overwhelming majority of evidence on the question of life after death supports the idea of a SINGLE self experiencing PERSONAL immortality and NOT the reincarnation tosh. Hi Big Lin, How do you perceive God? God is Spirit and if we are made in God's image, that must make us Spirit as well. So why do you think of yourself as the physical body Soul ( Spirit ) is reborn into a physical body again and again. The makeup of the body contains a path that has been chosen by Soul in corroboration with the heirarchy, a path that will teach Soul what it needs to know. As that path unfolds as the child grows the child or its parents are making choices. These choices are freewill choices and will be used to decide if the path is going to proceed as was intended or if there are going to be changes made. The path is there because it has been decided that it was the best way to go, but every person decides if they are going to continue to follow that path. I am sure your parents didn't expect you to make the decicions that you did that got you mixed up with a gang. Every move you made and action that you carried out, was yours alone. So you yourself made all the decision and you cannot deny that Karma is a Law put in place by God to teach not to punish. A person punishes themselves by their own choices. You must have been very obstinate as a child and were disobedient to your parents wishes. I am sure they didn't tell you to join a gang.
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Post by Big Lin on Jun 18, 2015 22:13:34 GMT
Let's try and keep this simple. 1 You do NOT 'know for a fact' that reincarnation exists. A FACT is something that everyone can agree on and that can be proved to EVERYONE beyond any reasonable doubt. You say you were 'shown many past lives' - what you mean is that you had a number of inner, private experiences which as such CAN'T be fact because they're subjective and FACTS are open to us all to verify or falsify. The verse in the Bible you quote is NOT talking about reincarnation; it's talking about being spiritually reborn and becoming a better person who tries to live in Christ. 2 'Reap what you sow' refers to and by definition implies freedom of choice to do good or evil. Karma is quite different since it lays predestined burdens on innocent babies for their alleged past lives. So karma means that free will is impossible and so there's no point in blaming or praising people for any action since everything they do is beyond their control. No one is to blame; only that bar steward karma who seems to be a sadistic nut who enjoys hurting people! And none of us knows if there is a world beyond this one and if there is none of us knows anything about it. There are theories and some evidence but the overwhelming majority of evidence on the question of life after death supports the idea of a SINGLE self experiencing PERSONAL immortality and NOT the reincarnation tosh. Hi Big Lin, How do you perceive God? God is Spirit and if we are made in God's image, that must make us Spirit as well. So why do you think of yourself as the physical body Soul ( Spirit ) is reborn into a physical body again and again. The makeup of the body contains a path that has been chosen by Soul in corroboration with the heirarchy, a path that will teach Soul what it needs to know. As that path unfolds as the child grows the child or its parents are making choices. These choices are freewill choices and will be used to decide if the path is going to proceed as was intended or if there are going to be changes made. The path is there because it has been decided that it was the best way to go, but every person decides if they are going to continue to follow that path. I am sure your parents didn't expect you to make the decicions that you did that got you mixed up with a gang. Every move you made and action that you carried out, was yours alone. So you yourself made all the decision and you cannot deny that Karma is a Law put in place by God to teach not to punish. A person punishes themselves by their own choices. You must have been very obstinate as a child and were disobedient to your parents wishes. I am sure they didn't tell you to join a gang. How do I perceive God? Lord, that's a question even theologians would probably give a thousand different answers to. But your argument that we are made in the image of God cuts both ways. In the first place is only man made in the image of God? If so, then us women are not made in God's image. If both men and women are made in the image of God (and Genesis gives two different accounts but the earlier version by the Elohist states 'male and female made He both') then God must be a hermaphrodite with both male and female characteristics. But more fundamentally if humans are made in the image of God then God must also have a physical dimension so He can't be pure spirit any more than we can. Like us, He must have a physical dimension. If 'the makeup of the body contains a path that has been chosen by soul in corroboration with the hierarchy' then right away free will disappears because the 'makeup of the body' is already predetermined and therefore free will is not just illusory but impossible. I have never denied that it was entirely my fault that I made bad choices as a teenager and got into bad company and did a lot of bad and criminal things. But then I don't believe in karma; I believe in moral responsibility and I know that what I did was wrong. I certainly was obstinate as a child and I was a disobedient one. But lots of other kids are like that and still have the sense not to do what I did. And anyway I freely admit it was my fault and my fault alone and karma had nothing to do with it. If karma was true both I and my parents would have been unable to take any other path because after all it would be our karma. So karma, yet again, makes free will impossible and therefore any kind of moral code impossible. There's just NO rational basis for praise or condemnation of any action if it's all down to karma. I prefer to believe that it was my own fault. Karma gives everyone a free pass.
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Thoughts
Jun 18, 2015 23:54:58 GMT
via mobile
Post by Scottish Lassie on Jun 18, 2015 23:54:58 GMT
hi Big Lin, You are still not comprehending. Karma is the Law. You reap what you sow is the result of what you yourself puts into action. So that stays your responsibility, you cannot run away from that fact. You are the one making the choices all the time.
The path is there for you to learn and that includes all the baggage that you put into action which still needs to be resolved. Until you resolve these problems they will stay with you as Karma, which is ofcoursethe results of prior action.
It is very rare for a Soul to get rid of the consequences of its actions in one lifetime, hence the reason for reincarnation. The actions that are not of a Godly nature will follow you until you realise that they need to be resolved, and when this has been achieved you evolve spiritually step by step until you are able to enter the Kingdom of God.
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